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Reduced Reliance on RNG (from the perspective of a game maker)

Posted 2021-12-13 06:27:45
#594914
The battling UI tells you very little about what affects your chances. I didn't know about the dice thing until someone in this thread mentioned it. Things like Prey Species or Slow Enemy matter - but unless you really dig into it or read guides, you won't know. You won't know if it's slow or brave.

I do think that RNG could still be tweaked even with better displays for chances and affecting factors. I do think that levels should matter more than (mostly) just health. It does still feel bad to lose to a lvl 5 fox as a lvl 20 wolf - just because it managed to bleed you, you can't get rid of the bleed (fail or unable to rest successfully), and you miss enough of your attempts to just fail.
Ihmislehma
#1850
Posted 2021-12-16 08:27:22
#598341
Huge support for this. When I was training what is currently my lead wolf, I was trying to give him good speed and strength in hopes that he'd be able to move first in battle more often, and hit enemies harder than his predecessor. Afterward however, I learned that the stats of your lead wolf don't actually matter, and battles are basically 100% RNG; the only difference of a higher level wolf is that it has more health and thus can take more hits. This was extremely discouraging for me, and honestly I don't battle beyond the sake of leveling and daily quests anymore because of it. My level 14 wolf should not lose to a level 5 caribou because I happened to roll ones a couple times after being wounded.
Wicked--Fang
#16364
Posted 2021-12-16 18:33:29
#598960
combat being overly reliant on RNG instead of stats or even level is a bit boring, yeah. i mean, i guess being able to steamroll level 1 opponents consistently isn't very engaging, but knowing that the entire thing is basically a set of dice rolls is also not super engaging, especially when a decently levelled wolf is, aside from HP, more or less evenly matched with a level 1 fox or turkey vulture.
it'd be nice if stats at least provided a modifier to some rolls, although i think i'd like to see something a lil more in-depth than that. 		MozarteanChaos
#53223
Posted 2021-12-19 20:30:11
#602100
Support! I've been feeling this, and kinda stopped leveling at 10. Reason being is that's the minimum level for chased, (even then the increased chance in chased doesn't seem to be noticed by people.)
❄️Meteorstar ❄️
#11545
Posted 2021-12-22 20:46:37
#606393
Support for all the reasons being said and I'm starting to think the devs don't care to look into the broken battling system much less attempt to even try to rework it from the ground up at this rate. Battling infuriates me at this point.
Either way, I don't battle outside snake quests at this point, and I'm already above level 10 so I'm getting chased NBWs and trophies, I have access to the perks I want, I don't need to level anymore imo. Fck leveling and fck battling if it's gonna stay like this. I'm honestly just gonna resort to working on my pack and lore building since at least that's less frustrating. 		Emerald
#5398
Posted 2022-01-07 18:09:33
#619634
it'd be nice if stats at least provided a modifier to some rolls, although i think i'd like to see something a lil more in-depth than that.

Stats do provide modifiers to a lot of rolls. For instance, this excellent post by Dzanek is a guide to fighting bears and explains how stats factor into every stage of combat. Some examples:

- The initial roll that determines whether you or the enemy goes first is subject to a stat modifier (the exact stat varies by enemy).
- If you go first, the different opening moves function off different stats. Snarl has no modifiers; focus has a smarts modifier; lunge/chase have a speed modifier. So you have to consider your lead's stats. My lead has high smarts, which means that focus is generally his optimal starting move.
- Latch is subject to a strength modifier, while bite gets no stat modifiers and an automatic -1 penalty. So if you're wondering "should I latch or bite?" it depends on your strength versus the enemy's strength.

I'm not saying it's the greatest battle system, but it's much more stat-based than it seems. Having good stats and knowing the mechanics will allow you to mitigate RNG in the majority of battles. You still won't win every battle, but it helps a ton.
Lionel
#34199
Posted 2022-01-07 19:44:47
#619680
Tala also has mentioned to pay attention, which is hard to do since we're emotional creatures. We see, "enemy hit lead for 6/7 damage," and go, "the heck?" - it's not obvious to people they can hover over dice rolls to see these stat modifiers (or hold tap over dice on mobile) - and your first lead is goin' to get most of an advantage over prey (Chase having a +2 since they are prey, and Wait a +1).

Anything which is not typically etted by wolves (cougar, birds, et cetera) does not have Prey Opponent modifier, meaning it is harder to defeat them, in general. There is also +1 Slow Opponent for some, which again, we would have to know to hover/hold tap to find. I know it is on certain snakes, and even the bears (they're another story entirely due to Fearless -1 and high Strength breakpoints, but it is a bear, for Tala's sake... as in, I don't expect to down every single bear without much experience and preparation like Lucky Feet).

They've also stated Wolvden is meant to be played over time. This means there is an expectation for combat to feel... difficult until we get to a certain point (stat breakpoints for example). However, let it not be said I do not feel frustrated at times, too. Often, it's something akin to Wounded status inflicted on first turn. We don't quite get the same thing, though a successful Lunge on birds (7 damage, "stunned" = 'free' damage) - and sometimes other critters can feel impactful, if you get that first turn, anyway.
Zeraki
#26932
Posted 2022-01-07 19:52:14
#619682
Oh for sure, I get frustrated too. "oh GOD the bear bled me AGAIN first turn, WHY"

(but now I know why: it's because my lead has comparatively poor agility. this doesn't help me beat that bear, but it does help me feel better about the whole thing, somehow)
Lionel
#34199
Posted 2022-01-08 08:18:44 (edited)
#619805
when i wrote my addition i wasn't aware of the bonuses some stats gave, so thank you for providing an explanation! i do think it wouldn't hurt to make that more obvious, and/or perhaps to make their role a bit more significant in some way 		MozarteanChaos
#53223
Posted 2022-02-01 08:33:59
#649554
New player here! I 100% agree with this. The same can go for lioden's battle system if you think about it (though it's been awhile since I last played that game.) The battle system definitely needs a rework up until I realized that my lead woldf's stats don't matter now I know how I somehow lost to a level 1 when I am currently level 3! It's sad to know that my lead wolf would not be progressing especially when stats have no effect in battle. It's almost discouraging. Hope they can improve this feature soon!!
lixue
#57093
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