please don’t integrate karma! (addendum: at least not how exists in LD)
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Posted 2022-10-26 14:40:57
I don't understand why killing something for food would be considered a "bad" option because you're a wolf? That needs to eat? Like it's not a good or bad choice it's a matter of living. Wolves don't go "hehe I am so naughty I will slap a tortoise for evil purposes >:3 ", chances are they've never seen one and are confused and intrigued by it. Just like they're not a divine saint for hiding a mouse under their paw so a bird can't eat it. Plus lioden has a horrible favour to the "evil" side which irks me, it took them so, so long to even add a good counterpart to an evil personality that had a unique perk to it. If you're gonna have karma it needs to be balanced both ways because that's the whole idea of it. I have no doubts that they'll add it in regardless of player input, I just hope that they'll add a toggle so I don't have to deal with it. Being completely black and white is so boring. |
 Doods #3294 |
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Posted 2022-10-26 19:25:36
lioden's can be very unpredictable & random, where even event encounters force karma choices that dont make sense for the specific encounters. (being serious, why is roaring at some mad ghost whose lunging at you *first* something evil?  )any good/evil system that isnt based on 'intentional acts of kindness'/'intentional acts of cruelty', may as well be purely random anyway. |
 Kirrah #2801 |
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Posted 2022-10-26 20:01:40
Or if it's going to affect explore, don't have it be tied to what's earned from the encounter - it would be more like flavor text. That way, you won't have to consider whether what you're earning is worth the karma change. (Because a lot of choices are morally gray anyway.) And it would be easier to pick which of the three 'sides' of karma you want to align with, because most of it would be from interacting with your own pack instead of chance encounters that only happen when you have the energy. Helps to avoid it altogether, too. Most black-white systems for karma just straight-up don't work well. |
 Whirligig #11137 |
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Posted 2022-10-27 10:51:20
Depending on how it affects the game--how balanced it is, whether it's what you do in explore, whether you give gifts to friends, if "evil" actions are favored, etc--I may just stop playing. I loathed everything I did in Lioden to get food or even to be PLAYFUL called my lion "evil" and gave him a negative title. I don't want to have to deal with the two options available making my wolf "bad;" both the bat and the Lunar crow encounters have the options to chase or growl/grab. I'd think those both would lead to negative karma... Am I supposed to just waste energy and the chance of a reward to be "good"? And what about the raccoon? Your only option is to investigate, leading to you stealing the raccoon's object. Does that count as evil? Does my only option make me "evil"? I can understand in the spring; you can rummage through the stores for food or eat the raccoon's kits. But then...would rummaging through the stores count as "evil" since you're stealing? I just don't want to have to second guess every single action in this game. |
 Sunny #30082 |
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Posted 2022-10-27 14:29:09
The Cryptid event has a good example. The encounter where a raccoon is falling into a giant crack in the earth. You can help, or ignore. Since this doesn't really have anything to do with regular wolf behavior (hunting, eating, playing, being curious, etc), and is clearly a good vs bad, it's a good example. Will you help a fellow animal in clear, dire need under unexpected, pressured, circumstance, or ignore them cuz you don't care. I really REALLY hope karma doesn't villainize hunting, killing for food, being curious. I keep thinking about how annoying and straight up wrong that is. Evil wolves should be EVIL, causing intentional havoc, making everyone's lives harder on purpose, killing for the fun of it. And good wolves shouldn't be just normal wolves either. It shouldn't be "here's evil and then here's a reg wolf". Good wolves should be just as dramatized. Going out of there way to help, putting others first before themselves, not killing even if they should/need to, /going/ the extra mile to be good. It shouldn't be "kill for fun, and your bad — but if you don't do anything you're good". It should be "kill for fun and you're bad but if you go out of your way to help you're good". I hope this makes sense. I also feel having the options give a little more context could help. Sometimes they don't make sense to me. I'll click one option thinking it's good, and it's not, and vice versa. |
 Remmie #8429 |
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Posted 2022-10-27 15:22:58
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Sunny #30082 |
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Posted 2022-11-05 14:50:12 (edited)
If it *has* to be good/evil though, it should be balanced in a way that users have to actively work towards achieving a good or evil title - random selections should result in neutral kharma. That makes the system inherently opt-in. |
 Badger #10939 |
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Posted 2022-11-05 16:19:03
"good karma" and "bad karma" is descriptive enough, i think! garnering bad or good karma definitely shouldn't be tied to making survival or sacrificial decisions, unless it's opt-in. or anyway that's my opinion lol |
 Arcadia /hiatus #1119 |
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Posted 2022-11-05 22:22:24
"This poor antelope is feeling very sick" =/= "antelope is choking on grass." It's foaming at the mouth/drooling--it's seriously ill and needs to be killed to prevent spreading disease. 
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Sunny #30082 |
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Posted 2022-11-06 00:47:48 (edited)
explore as it is rn feels incredibly stale. if they loop karma into explore it'll be different for a while and new things can always be released that will provide more karma encounters. as it is right now when i do explore i'm just kinda clicking through. if i wanna play an absolute evil goblin, i'd like to be able to do so and earn a title for it. if you're metagaming to get the better rewards and you don't like the karma you get, then that's an issue with metagaming as a whole -- having to take lesser rewards sometimes for the rp experience or the karma is, in my opinion, a more interesting game to play than just going "well what gets me the best possible reward". also there's all this talk of it not being realistic but i really don't understand what the problem with that is -- if your wolf is going out of its way to thrill-kill things in explore when the pack hunts sustain it perfectly well i could see that being justification for the kill options being bad karma tbh, and i'd buy that. but my hope is that they make the good/bad karma things more dynamic than that, so it's like not... "do you kill this possum" or something like that and more "do you push this coyote into a river to drown it to steal its stuff" and what have you. karma being a reflection of being malicious/good deliberately is what i hope they ultimately go with tbh as opposed to somewhat hard to parse decisions. |
 BIG RED RAT #41885 |